ANTON001:
1. does the no vote (that won) mean we DEFINATLY wont have omaha in next season?
2. if not does that mean that we may as well have ONE league then?

No on both accounts Anton. The vote was to canvass league players thoughts about a combined league (hold'em/omaha), but it surely will weight in the decision process. Also, whether it will be one league or A and B league as it was this year is not yet a given.

On the other thread members were providing us with options and ideas how the best tackle/solve/arrange the league for the coming season. No definitive decision has been taken as of yet.

Our wish is to try to get the most wanted and effective format done. Honestly, as far as I am concerned, I haven't been able to see what the wish of majority is or what the best format would be.

Luckily we have time to swap more thoughts on this --and thus all of us are/can be part of the process. Someone will always feel that the structure should be different, but hopefully in the end of the road we can all agree that what ever the shape is, we still will be having fun playing it.

Now that I am at this, we have to solve a few more matters as well. We all have to think of the rules (changes/additions where needed) for the coming season and how we structure the appeals process. This year certainly didn't work out as intended.

(For the record: I am not saying this just because I happened to be part of the committee and did cause more than enough damage/confusion or what ever one wants to call it by the rulings I was part of.)

Also, maybe we ought to think if we want to keep the scoring form as it is or make a change to it, so that it would be in line with common game winning practice (3 points to winning team, make a tie possible, 1 point each team --and the losing team scoring 0 points).

Let's get the job done people.

FF

P.S.: Some of you have already put forth some good points and options elsewhere. Maybe you could be kind to copy/paste your thoughts here, if you think it is relevant to the discussion. Thanks all.

I believe its a good ideal always to find how others feel about things they are involved in, i voted for omaha ,but would not have a problem if it was removed from the league.
As for them format i cannot reconcile myself with any reason for a major and minor league, one season can make all the difference in the world, so to be in a league where from the start you cant win the whole thing dosent make any sense.
The one thing i believe that has to be in place is what to do if a team quits the league, as we all have seen in both leagues that seems to be the where everything can be undone.
Whatever is decided must be set in stone an enacted when a team decides to go this route for any reason.That way everyone realizes the consequence,s of quitting and not just a bargaining chip to use to negotiate a favorable outcome.

Just my thoughts.

So why we dont vote on

A Bigleague without omaha
B 2 leagues with omaha??

I fact i dont understand why we didnt start with this..

I would like to think that Omaha has been out voted so it's gone. Maybe we could set up a Omaha league on it's own.

I would also like to see every captain on the committee or just a captains vote after all the captains do all the hard work a desserve a say on what happens

I do agree with you , and the captains can go to their players if they want...

The advantage of the current scoring system is that a match yields a constant total number of points: 39.

Therefore, there is a Par at 19.5 and this way you know after N games
if a team is a losing or winning one on average by looking its position
with respect to the Par (N * 19.5).

You can also crosscheck quicky if there was no input error in the score grid
by checking that the total of points is (N * 39) after N matches,
as an input error most often changes the expected total.

If a match can either yield 2 points (1-1) or 3 points (3-0),
these two advantages disappear.

As for the impossibility of a tie, it is an advantage,
as we can play the knock-out tournaments using same scoring system,
with the guarantee that a match will yield the elimination of one of the two teams.

The scoring system is fine as it is, dont we have enough problems we have to sort out.

I wouldn't want to qualify our wish to improve the league as having problems, but maybe it is just me...;-))

As to the scoring; I see your point bat, however I think it is not the most optimal system as a bad beat for a team in one game can result in substantial shift of position. Just my thoughts... and I never made a check if that would change the overall results of the past season by much.....maybe you will do that bat?

Suppose a match is played with current scoring system, and then two different tamperings A or B are applied.

Tampering A)
3 points given to team making score > 19.5
0 given given to team making score < 19.5

Tampering B)
3 points given to team making score >= 21
1 point given to team making 19 or 20
0 given given to team making score <= 18

Then, with tamprings A or B respectively, this would yield, e.g., for League B:

A:18 or B:09+3=12 Pain
A:18 or B:15+3=18 Lords
A:18 or B:18+0=18 Tiers
A:18 or B:18+1=19 Soul
A:24 or B:18+3=21 Ninjas
A:21 or B:21+2=23 Hoof
A:24 or B:24+0=24 Cats
A:27 or B:24+2=26 IAK

The problem with such tamperings is that as soon a team is mathematically beat during a match,
it will stop to play or their players will bingo, as there's no point to continue playing.

Also, this squeezes the scores to much: If you look at the curves on bat stats site
you'll see that in order to win, a team must not only have with huges wins,
but most importantly must still behave well in defeat and limit the damages
by having only moderate losses.

If you look at the curve of the ninjas, you'll see that it's where they win:
Their losses, all concentrated in the first half of season were moderate.

Fellow league players we are trying to sort out a system that is best for all just give us some time please we will get back to you.
We have enough info from you just now.

Structure

The recent vote has showed that half the league don't like omaha - its not fair for so many people to suffer playing a game they don't like - the first season was better. On the other hand it shows that there is enough support for omaha and it seems unfair for it to disappear. So:

One league of holdem teams all playing each other once.

An omaha league of a lower amount of teams (judging by the vote it should be around half the teams) - either a cup or a mini league either run at the same time or off-season.

Appeals

Transparency is important and spreading the responsibility stops a few people being perceived as holding and potentially abusing "power"; so, a captains committee is a much better idea compared to the previous format:

Each captain should take a vote from their players and not act on their own, regarding decisions. That way, fairly quick responses from a lot of people are captured (captains obviously have to set deadlines for responding e.g. using email).

Possibly, if any contentious issues need privacy and/or a quick decision, then, Emil should step in.

Scoring

Current system is great.

....hadn't noticed your post before posting.

Like i said got enough info thanks for posting

Sorry folks,

I jumped the gun here. Others are taking care of this already.

I will close the thread.